<div dir="ltr"><div>The point I was trying to make was that, assuming that there are no large outliers skewing the final RMS(angles), an overall RMS of 2.3-2.7 would be worrisome. <br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 1:21 PM, Pavel Afonine <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:pafonine@lbl.gov" target="_blank">pafonine@lbl.gov</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hi Ed,<br>
<br>
yes, that's right. One is to detect severe outliers that may screw up the overall numbers. The other one is to compare these overall numbers with those derived from similar structures available in the data base.<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Pavel</font></span><div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
On 9/19/14 11:05 AM, Edward A. Berry wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Two different histograms involved here?<br>
For one structure, histogram of the deviations at all the different bonds, angles<br>
For the entire PDB, histogram of rmsd of all the different structures<br>
<br>
On 09/19/2014 12:50 PM, Katherine Sippel wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
This is from Phenix's FAQ page...<br>
<br>
*"My resolution is X Angstroms; what should RMS(bonds) and RMS(angles) be?*<br>
<br>
This is somewhat controversial, but absolute upper limits for a well-refined protein structure at high resolution are typically 0.02 for RMS(bonds) and 2.0 for RMS(angles); usually they will be significantly lower. As resolution decreases the acceptable deviation from geometry restraints also decreases, so at 3.5 Angstrom, more appropriate values would be 0.01 and 1.0."<br>
<br>
If the histogram shows that the RMS(angles) average higher than 2 then I think that would be a result of poorly refined structures skewing the graph rather than a reflection of what the RMS should be.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Fri, Sep 19, 2014 at 1:57 AM, Pavel Afonine <<a href="mailto:pafonine@lbl.gov" target="_blank">pafonine@lbl.gov</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:pafonine@lbl.gov" target="_blank">pafonine@lbl.gov</a>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
Hi,<br>
<br>
if you make sure these values are not caused by a handful of atoms that flew a distance apart for whatever reason then values like ok to me. This is why looking at a histogram of deviations (bond, angles etc) is way more useful than looking at just one number!<br>
<br>
Pavel<br>
<br>
<br>
On 9/18/14 1:32 PM, C wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hi,<br>
<br>
Refining using phenix I find the RMS angle drifting towards 2.3-2.7 range when validating the resulting structure.<br>
<br>
These are high resolution structures and I was wondering if someone could comment on whether 2.3-2.7 values are worrisome?<br>
Thank you<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
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