A couple of questions regarding twinning
Dear all, A couple of questions regarding twinning: 1. The structure I work with has multiple twinning domains (4 to be exact, with pseudo-orthorhombic 222 symmetry induced by twinning in P1). I feed the autobuild script the operators using a keyord: input_files.refine_eff_file_list=mytwinrefinement.eff (see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used. Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any previously defined one? If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple twinning domains/operators? 2. Output structure factor amplitudes: are they detwinned? Are they detwinned before the density modification in resolve? and during it? Thanks for any clarification/suggestions Regards Pietro
Hi Pietro, I can answer part of this; hopefully others can cover the rest. The output structure factor amplitudes from autobuild (i.e., exptl_fobs_hl_coeffs_freeR_flags.mtz) should be the same as the input ones (e.g., from "data=....") The maps are not detwinned unless you specify (as might be a good idea) "two_fofc_in_rebuild" in which case with your refinement parameters file you would get 2mFo-DFc maps from phenix.refine that are using detwinned data. There is currently no way to detwin the data in autobuild and use the detwinned data in density modification (this would be a useful thing to have, yes). You would have to put in detwinned data to start with as "data" to do this. All the best, Tom T
1. The structure I work with has multiple twinning domains (4 to be exact, with pseudo-orthorhombic 222 symmetry induced by twinning in P1). I feed the autobuild script the operators using a keyord:
input_files.refine_eff_file_list=mytwinrefinement.eff
(see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used. Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any previously defined one?
If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple twinning domains/operators?
2. Output structure factor amplitudes: are they detwinned? Are they detwinned before the density modification in resolve? and during it?
Thanks for any clarification/suggestions
Regards
Pietro
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On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Pietro Roversi wrote: (see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used.
Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains
adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any
previously defined one? Correct. If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple
twinning domains/operators? Currently phenix.refine is limited to a single twin operator.
-Nat
On a related note, how is the R factor calculated with twinned structures (i.e., how is Fcalc determined for the purposes of R factor calculation)? Thanks, Owen On Jun 3, 2010, at 10:27 AM, Nathaniel Echols wrote:
wrote: (see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used. Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Pietro Roversi
Correct.
If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple twinning domains/operators?
Currently phenix.refine is limited to a single twin operator.
-Nat
Hi Owen,
R = |Fobs - Wcalc|/Fobs
Wcalc = sqrt( alpha Fcalc1^2 + Fcalc2^2(1-alpha) )
Sorry Pietro, only a single domain is possible at this moment.
Map coefficients are such that effects of twinning are not present
2010/6/3 Owen Pornillos
On a related note, how is the R factor calculated with twinned structures (i.e., how is Fcalc determined for the purposes of R factor calculation)? Thanks, Owen
On Jun 3, 2010, at 10:27 AM, Nathaniel Echols wrote:
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Pietro Roversi
wrote: (see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used. Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any previously defined one?
Correct.
If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple twinning domains/operators?
Currently phenix.refine is limited to a single twin operator. -Nat
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-- ----------------------------------------------------------------- P.H. Zwart Beamline Scientist Berkeley Center for Structural Biology Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratories 1 Cyclotron Road, Berkeley, CA-94703, USA Cell: 510 289 9246 BCSB: http://bcsb.als.lbl.gov PHENIX: http://www.phenix-online.org CCTBX: http://cctbx.sf.net -----------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Pietro, refinement of 4-domain twinning has been reported in CNS with adapted input scripts; see; http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15858272 The scripts are available through the IUCR electronic archive as supplementary material; http://journals.iucr.org/d/issues/2005/05/00/wd5026/wd5026sup1.zip Maybe this can be helpful for your case. Jonathan -- Jonathan Elegheert Ph.D. Student Unit for Structural Biology& Biophysics http://www.lprobe.ugent.be/xray.html Lab for Protein Biochemistry and Biomolecular Engineering Department of Biochemistry& Microbiology Ghent University, Belgium e-mail: [email protected] Op 6/3/2010 4:36 PM, Peter Zwart schreef:
Hi Owen,
R = |Fobs - Wcalc|/Fobs
Wcalc = sqrt( alpha Fcalc1^2 + Fcalc2^2(1-alpha) )
Sorry Pietro, only a single domain is possible at this moment.
Map coefficients are such that effects of twinning are not present
2010/6/3 Owen Pornillos
: On a related note, how is the R factor calculated with twinned structures (i.e., how is Fcalc determined for the purposes of R factor calculation)? Thanks, Owen
On Jun 3, 2010, at 10:27 AM, Nathaniel Echols wrote:
On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Pietro Roversi
wrote: (see attached file) but only the last one seems to be used. Do I guess correctly that there is only provision for two domains adn therefore the last twinning definition overrides any previously defined one?
Correct.
If so, is there a way of specifying and using multiple twinning domains/operators?
Currently phenix.refine is limited to a single twin operator. -Nat
_______________________________________________ phenixbb mailing list [email protected] http://phenix-online.org/mailman/listinfo/phenixbb
Hi Owen,
On a related note, how is the R factor calculated with twinned structures (i.e., how is Fcalc determined for the purposes of R factor calculation)?
here are the formulas that are used in phenix.refine, phenix.model_vs_data and other related tools for the R-factor and total model structure factor Fmodel: http://cci.lbl.gov/~afonine/FandR/Fmodel_and_Rfactor.pdf Pavel.
participants (7)
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Jonathan Elegheert
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Nathaniel Echols
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Owen Pornillos
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Pavel Afonine
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Peter Zwart
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Pietro Roversi
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Thomas C. Terwilliger